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Outlander 800Max burning up stators...


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#1 joevh

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 12:16 PM

I have a 2006 800 that I had to replace the stator on 1 1/2 years ago, due to it not charging, and the stator was burned.  I installed one from RM Stators, and now this one has burned up as well.  I just replaced it with another RM Stator, and this time I replaced the voltage regulator as well with one of their Mosfet style regulators.  My question is, why are they burning up?  I can maybe understand the first time, as it was 12 years old, but this second one only had about 29 hours on it.  Maybe it was just a bad one, but I suspect there must be a cause for this.  

 

The one thing that's different is that I installed a Rigid LED 6" light bar on it prior to the first stator burning up.  I spliced it into one of the high beam headlight wires.  I know that a separate relay would be more proper, but this is a fairly low wattage light; I can't remember but am thinking about 45 watts.  I also have aftermarket hand warmers on this.  Would the combination of hand warmers and the LED light really overwork the stator to cause it to burn up?  I have had the hand warmers on it for about 9 years now.  I am considering cutting the wires to the high beam lights to disable them and only use the Rigid LED when I select high beam, as it makes a lot more light than the headlights and probably draws less amps as well, but thought I would seek out opinions before I do that.  I should add that the connectors all look very clean with no signs of burning or arcing and they are full of dielectric grease.

 

Thanks.

 

Joe


Edited by joevh, 12 November 2019 - 12:17 PM.


#2 Dr Z

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Posted 13 November 2019 - 12:16 AM

Mine is a 2011 with power steering. Pretty sure a larger output stator on it than yours unless the aftermarket one is larger than stock. I run 2 10 watt round LED lights off the high beam wires. I run heated grips, GPS and an AFR+ with O2 sensor off the spare 12V plug up front with no issues. I did have to do the stator wire plug upgrade on mine though. They had 2 different wire sizes at the 3 yellow wire plug between the stator and the rectifier. If you haven't checked that plug, might be a place to look. Can Am has a replacement kit for the plug if it's still available and you need it.

Also, do you have really clean and tight battery cables?


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#3 joevh

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Posted 13 November 2019 - 06:16 PM

I will check the cleanliness of the battery cables, but I do know they are tight.

 

I should also ask another question:  In investigating charging issues, the service manual says to disconnect the VR/Rectifier wire from the solenoid, then start the engine, then connect a voltmeter to the disconnected VR wire and connect the other end of it to the solenoid and measure the amperage across that.  When I disconnect the VR wire from the solenoid, the machine is stone dead and cannot be started.  This is the same before and after I replaced the voltage regulator/rectifier.  So, does this indicate a problem on my bike, or was the procedure written incorrectly in the service manual?  Could someone else please try that procedure and see if your outlander is electrically dead with the VR wire disconnected from the solenoid?



#4 ozymax

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Posted 13 November 2019 - 08:07 PM

The test procedure tells you to disconnect the VR, then install a test harness.

I would imagine this harness would then supply power through it, so the bike will run and supply a means of connecting the meter.

Pretty sure an 06 machine will have a 400w magneto. Running heaters, head lights and a light bar may well push the limits and then the cooling fan comes on.

What wattage bulbs do you have in the head lights?

 

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#5 joevh

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Posted 14 November 2019 - 10:06 AM

The test I'm referring to is on a page or two earlier in the manual, and is as I described, without hooking up a harness; just an electrical tester, and it tests for amps.  Although I don't have the harness they refer to, I did the voltage test that you posted by disconnecting the connectors and just testing for volts between the 3 pins in the stator wire.  The bike will run fine like that, as long as you have a good battery.

 

I have the factory headlight bulbs in it, along with the LED which I think is around 45 watts.  



#6 ozymax

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Posted 14 November 2019 - 05:49 PM

Ah yes, I see the procedure now. Sorry.

Looking at the wiring diagram, there should still be a feed to the bikes electrical system with this wire disconnected and there for, run.

I wonder if someone has crimped all the wires together into one terminal?

 

I have an 07 Outlander that I can go and compare for you, but it's a couple of hundred K's away. I will be going out there in a couple of days time. I'll try and have a look for you.

In the meantime, I'd strip the loom back a little and try to identify if something has changed it from factory.

See if you can identify the wire that runs from the solenoid post to the main fuse box down the back. This is the one you need to have connected still.

Should be a 12 gauge, Red wire according to the sheet and that is also the same size and colour of the rectifier wire.



#7 joevh

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Posted 14 November 2019 - 09:15 PM

Thanks, Ozymax.  I'll check it out.  Nice of you to try it on your Outy when you can.



#8 7shortmag

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Posted 15 November 2019 - 07:27 AM

One of my bikes burned up a water bucket full of stators. i tried EVERYTHING.

Finally, I replaced the flywheel and the problem was fixed.

 

Did you ever remove the flywheel?

Did the flywheel ever take a blow? (strike it with a hammer or wrench)

There are a bunck of magnets in the flywheel, my guess is that one of them is crackes or bad in some way.


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#9 joevh

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Posted 15 November 2019 - 09:41 AM

I'm not home to look at the service manual, but I think I did remove the flywheel when I replaced the first stator, as I also replaced the original, stretched out cam chains at that time.  



#10 7shortmag

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Posted 15 November 2019 - 12:12 PM

I'm not home to look at the service manual, but I think I did remove the flywheel when I replaced the first stator, as I also replaced the original, stretched out cam chains at that time.  

Did you remove the flywheel with the proper flywheel puller?

died you ever "tap" on it or drop it on the floor?

The magnets break really easily and you cannot see if they are broken or damaged.

Broken or damaged magnets create a different sine field and have an effect on sharging.


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#11 ozymax

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Posted 16 November 2019 - 04:14 AM

Ok, had a quick look at my bike.

I didn't have the time or tools to disconnect any wiring though. My wiring at the solenoid has the large starter cable and 3x red wires coming into 1x terminal.

So I'd expect the bike to be dead with that terminal removed.

I'd suggest peeling back some loom tube and finding the wire that supplies the power to the main fuse, which I assume is 1 of the 3 fuses near the battery.

Cutting that wire out of the terminal, so that the bike can be powered up.

I will be working on my bike in a week or 2 and would be in a better position to do some more investigating for you, if you are still stuck.

 

I also agree 100% with what 7shortmag has said. The flywheels are tough but fragile at the same time and need to be handled correctly.



#12 joevh

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Posted 16 November 2019 - 11:41 AM

I did remove the flywheel, but I have the proper puller and used it.  Can't remember if it took a fall or anything.  Wish there was a way to test the flywheel, as they're $430 to replace.  I just got home, and will look at my 2005 400 and see if it's wired the same way; if so, I'll try the test on it.  Will post results.



#13 joevh

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Posted 16 November 2019 - 07:34 PM

The manual doesn't call for that test to be done on my 400.  In fact, all of the charging system tests on it are different.  If somebody would be willing to try the described test, I would appreciate it.



#14 7shortmag

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Posted 20 November 2019 - 07:32 AM

Connect your meter to the battery, start the bike, rev it up to around 4,000 rpms.

Is it charging?


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#15 7shortmag

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Posted 20 November 2019 - 07:34 AM

I think you hit a good point that you should remove your LED from the high beam circuit.

These bikes do not have much headroom on their charging system, any unnecessary load should be avioded.


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#16 7shortmag

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Posted 20 November 2019 - 07:36 AM

Is there a splice/plug/connector between the stator and voltage regulator plug?

If yes, look at it very closely for bare or burnt wires.

 

Look at the entire wiring harness from the stator to the voltage regulator. Are there any bare wires that could be shorting out?


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#17 joevh

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Posted 21 November 2019 - 03:42 PM

Connect your meter to the battery, start the bike, rev it up to around 4,000 rpms.

Is it charging?

It wasn't before I replaced the stator and VR.  Now it charges fine.  My wire harness looks great.  The reason I'm still interested in that particular test procedure is to see if something is wrong in the wiring of my bike that may be causing the issue.  



#18 7shortmag

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 07:11 AM

So you have replaced everything but the flywheel.

The bike is charging.

 

Nothing is wrong.

 

If it eats another stator, replace the flywheel.

 

the only variable in your situation is:

Are the RM stators the same quality as OEM?

I cannot personally answer that question.


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